It's not the only way. It is a matter of strength and timing. That is why I recommended you dilute the HCl way down with water, Michael. It also reduces the surface alkalinity of the concrete that can cause some paints to adhere poorly. Can you use coffee to etch Damascus? Don't use a metal container acid can corrode many metals, leading to the possible destruction of the container. This advanced formula incorporates a custom blend of surfactants, organic minerals and derivatives of a plant based extract for the most effective concrete etching solution available. You don't need a lot. You can make a reasonable facsimile of ferric by dissolving steel wool in muriatic acid. I've since settle on at 4-1 dilution, and overall etching a blade takes 45-60 mins. Makes the material look like carbon steel Damascus. It is. Remove the Damascus from the acid and dip it in a bath of baking soda and distilled water to neutralize the acid. At 5-10 minute intervals, gently stir the copper etching solution to agitate the solution. Dunk it in the acetone again then allow to dry. Sprinkle the mixture evenly across the surface of the prepared concrete. i can't wait to mess with it. Ferric chloride is not an "acid" per se. This is how I do it and it works for me. Everything you need to know about ChatGPT. PURPLE Titanium Phillips Pocket Clip Screws M Fits - Etsy For this reason, true Damascus steel is called wootz Damascus steel to distinguish it from imitations. Always use a 1:10 muriatic acid to water the mixture so that the acid is not too strong and difficult to neutralize. on Introduction. With ferric acid, keep grit between 400 and 600. Use a sprayer or watering container to distribute the acid, scrubbing in as needed. Hose down or dampen the entire area. Actually, the process of efflorescence removal discussed above also etches the masonry. interesting, what's the science behind that? wow sounds like fun. Warm your acid to room temperature. Muratic acid is really not the stuff to use for etching especially inside your house or workshop. It will corrode everything in sight and do a number on your lungs. Muriatic acid will strip the galvanizing off, Ospho, which is phosphoric acid can be used to etch the zinc to get the paint to stick, it is also a 'rust reformer' changing ferric oxide 'rust' to phosphoric oxide, which is stable and can be painted with out worry about latter rusting. Ferric Chloride VS Muriatic Acid + Hydrogen Peroxide for etching There are two ways (at least) to do Raindrop that are much easier than doing a mosaic of jellyroll, one for use with a hydraulic press and one for use if you don't have a press. How do I heat-treat my stainless Damascus after purchase? I know the website says not to mix it but we're also not using it to make custom circuit boards Here is a link to some interesting information regarding concentrations Etching Damascus steel is usually to bring out the contrast between the layers; if that's not what you want, you might be better off with a mechanical etch that ignores the layers. Vegas Forge. I frequently etch damascus with ferric chloride. Step Three: Applying the Acid Solution. Cheers Johnno I should mention that this should be done outside since the vapors are stinky and it produces hydrogen gas. Using a broom, scrub the concrete with the acid solution. Putting acid on your travertine will cause it to initially bubble and fizz (CO2 escaping in the reaction). I dont own any Damascus and this is my first, so is that normal? Complete etches in a well ventilated space and wear gloves, eye protection, and an apron or old clothes. Can you etch Damascus steel with muriatic acid? 7. [_wpnonce] => Start very dilute, like 1:10 or 1:20. Sign up for a new account in our community. 3 years ago A short emersion (2-3 minutes) in diluted ferric chloride will show the pattern without etching too deep. The "active ingredient" in ferric chloride solution is hydrochloric acid. This comes pre-diluted, but I am not sure what the dilution rate is. Use the finishing sandpaper to tighten the top of the slightly raised steel, and the other metal will remain dark and healthy, giving you the best difference. Etch in Muriatic Acid from the local hardware store. Muriatic acid is "hydrochloric acid" (HCl) in a less pure and diluted strength for non-technical applications like cleaning bricks. Then you can either just let the solution be open to air for a few days or add a bit of the hydrogen peroxide and boom, ferric chloride. Be sure to always wear the appropriate protective gear when you're working with acid. NOT ALL DAMASCUS ARE MADE LIVING Damascus is made of many metallic combinations to form one piece. This is commonly sold in home improvement stores and pool supply stores in gallon jugs. As a major metal product on the market, strong power in Damascus is directly related to its quality. Etching with muriatic acid and hydrogen peroxide - YouTube The difference between steel metals creates those different ways, especially when used again. You will also need to wash a baking bar. [woocommerce-reset-password-nonce] => [woocommerce-reset-password-nonce] => What follows is a step-by-step tutorial on how to acid etch concrete with muriatic acid. Put a tablespoon or so of baking powder in a saucepan of water and boil the piece for 10 minutes. If this is the first time youre using this batch of solution (and I presume it is), itll etch super-fast. After being etched the blank can be polished to give a stepped or contrasting look. Klean-Strip Green 1 Gal. Green Muriatic Acid GKGM75006 - The Home Depot Copper can be etched with ferric chloride mixed in water to form weak hydrochloric acid. Don't touch it with your hands. Transchem Muriatic Acid 1 gal Liquid - Ace Hardware Using muriatic acid is no joke, and many DIYers believe it to be a . Free delivery and returns on eligible orders. Once it's clean put on your gloves and do not touch it with your bare hands until the whole process is complete. Any help would be greatly appreciated thanks guys. Collectors should ensure to keep their blades clean and dry to avoid rust or staining. This prepares your steel for an even etch. Before you begin, check the expiration date on your acid of choice to be sure that its not too old. It can also be used to remove soot from firebricks. Keep it submerged for 10 to 15 minutes. View all products of Market Price & Insight. Possible acids include muriatic (hydrochloric) acid (HCL), nitric acid (HNO3), or sulfuric acid (H2SO4). March 17, 2017 in Beginners Place. Michael, my advise would be to dilute it down subtantially with distilled water. Professional Strength 31.45% HCL (Muriatic Acid), excellent for pH reduction in swimming pools or to clean and etch masonry surfaces, excellent for pH reduction in all commercial and residential pools.Find the ACID MURIATIC GAL at Ace. Phone Number: 541-684-4623E-mail: info@rideable.orgMailing Address:P.O. [save-account-details-nonce] => Any form of agitation not only helps the etch to even out, it also helps the acid work faster by removing oxides from the surface of the steel. Yes. ( A standard strength for a careful etch on copper is 42 baume, above this and the ferric will etch more slowly as the solution is viscous. Do this process a few times. Acid etching a concrete floor is typically a 6-step process: Prepare, clean, and degrease concrete. Acid Etching: Acid Types, Metal Types, Applications, and Benefits The concentration from such sources is typically ~8.9M, or 32% (by mass). If you are having trouble getting Ferric, try using Muriatic. Once your Damascus is sanded to the correct grit, thoroughly wash it with alcohol and pat dry with a clean rag. There are five distinctive patterns from which to choose. Michael, it's easier to add more acid and try again than make it too strong and over-etch. The press method is the reverse. Dilute it about 4:1 water to acid. Is the pattern deep enough? Certain non-acids that form acid in water, such as ferric chloride (FeCl3) or copper sulfate (CuSO4), can also be used as etching chemicals. All you have to do is add a scrap piece of iron or steel to the muriatic acid (or hydrochloric acid; same thing) and wait for it to dissolve. I've personally gone as high as 6-1 dilution with ferric, but that took literally hours to obtain the depth of etch I wanted. I've done several tests, using the same pieces of steel, same amount if vinegar at the same temp, etc, and nothing is working as well as the first batch. Damascus Steel the two give much different results. My favorite supplier of muriatic acid is any place that carries pool supplies. Muriatic also contains some other stuff, typically iron, which is already starting to become ferric. Leave the copper blank in the solution for at least half an hour. A flask of cold water on top is useful to reduce evaporative losses. -----------------------------------------------"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. It's easy! You can also use Windex with this step, but do not try to break your piece. Steven Penner Joined Jan 29, 2006 Messages 606 Let your piece remain in acids for 10 to 15 minutes. Etching a stainless damascus steel knife (or any damascus) is not as complicated as many people tend to believe. My question at the moment is, will hot vinegar ruin the temper on a knife? It is AWESOME. Make sure your steel is clean. Suspend your piece in the acid. What is the black coating on knife blades? If you're using muriatic acid, you can bring the Damascus up to 1200 grit, or you can leave it at 400 grit. Muriatic Acid - Top Tips for Safe Use in Cleaning - Bob Vila It is an ultra high carbon steel that achieved liquid state which should, theoretically, allow you to get a homogeneous steel product with equal carbon distribution and no slag inclusions at all. https://www.amazon.com/MG-Chemicals-Ferric-Chloride-Liquid/dp/B008UH3SAE/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1492289092&sr=8-1&keywords=ferric+chloride. Safe Alternatives to Acid Etching Concrete Floors - All Garage Floors Go MINIMUM of 3-1 dilution with DISTILLED water only. Etching Damascus is a fairly straight forward process that can enhance the appearance of a Damascus blade. this makes Ferris chloride, you need to add hydrogen peroxide to convert to ferric , go slow in an over large container is is an energetic reaction the ferris will be a green color, add peroxide until it turns brown and it is ferric, add distilled water until it etches nicely. Chemicals that form acid in water, such as ferric (iron) chloride or copper sulfate can also be used as etching chemicals. The damascus is 5160/1018/15n20 nickle I heat treated in the canola got it cherry hot and dipped it tip down . Is it just lots of jelly rolls mushed together? Etching Concrete: The Process. In a large nonmetallic bowl or container, mix 1 part hydrochloric acid with 2 parts hydrogen peroxide. Damascus etching is completed with either ferric chloride or muriatic acid. When you have mixed the acid solution you can start acid etching the concrete. [save-account-details-nonce] => Damascus Etching. Ideally you want to test the strength needed first before doing the entire floor. Either will etch any high carbon steel, eventually. "Regular" ferric chloride tion for future etching. Even a single fingerprint will effect your acid etch, so be cautious. These products combine 50% of 50% of controversial rows in metal Damascus. The generally accepted shelf life of ferric chloride solution is approximately six months. Clean the blade. You can also neutralize muriatic acid with agricultural lime. Earn the Windex deep deep hole so that you can fully fill your Dutch item. Apparently this neutralises the piece as well as helping to set the oxides. I just etched my first Damascus blade. What kind of acid do you use to etch a knife? Acid reaches well in the cleanest place. It won't hurt glass or plastic, but the fumeswill eat a metal lid. Etching Damascus Blades WoodWorld of Texas Make Ferric Chloride (for etching printed circuit boards). Uses of Muriatic acid 1. The nice folks at Forseti have their own quality assurance system in place, and they design many of the more interesting knives in their catalog. Warm acid gives a much faster etch, but then you get less time to control what's happening. If you are having trouble getting Ferric, try using Muriatic. Other, safer products are available for etching concrete and should be used . The only bad experience is the one from which you learn nothing. I've been there before.. I assume I need to set the oxides but can I still do that weeks later? In our last etching video, linked below, we ended up using ferric chloride and then sulfuric acid, which didn't give the best results. Never put acid on the microwave! A place for all things chef knives. Take a high-layer bar and press it between dies that have been drilled full of almost-touching holes, then grind the resulting bumps off. and wear gloves, eye protection, and clothing. Beyond that it's a matter of experimentation. Then I remembered I'd been thinking of switching to re-usable etchant, created on the bench using muriatic acid (the store name for hydrochloric acid, HCl, used for cleaning swimming pools). . Dilute it about 4:1 water to acid. ), Server: Array It will also make everything steel in the same room with it rust. My first round of etching went very well, good contrasting colors and an even etch, but since then my etches have been splotchy with very little contrast. Ferric chloride is one of the most widely used etchants in the field of chemical etching. No odor, no smell, not a skin irritant, non-corrosive. Muriatic acid is diluted hydrochloric acid; it should be handled with extreme care. (Add the acid to the water, not water to acid, for safety reasons.) No, you'll be just fine etching after the heat treat process. Macroetch Solution - American Welding Society Reputable Member Journeyman Bladesmith (5yr) 3:1, 4:1, or 5:1 distilled water to the FeCl are all commonly used dilutions. We've made your buy experience less painful. Put on the goggles and vinyl gloves before mixing the chemicals. If you choose, you can finish with the 2000 grit buffing compound and the soft wheel to shine on your Damascus clip, but you will lose some of the difference between metal components. Add your Damascus clip to an acoustic container so that it can be released freely and not touch the sides or bottom of the container. No matter how effective it is. Good point about the rust bluing. hey guys, i used the lovely search function with pretty much no results. If you want a deeper etch, repeat steps 5 and 6. Shop Talk - BladeSmith Questions and Answers. I don't know if you need a specific concentration of ferric chloride for etching, but I can explain how to make any concentration of ferric chloride as well. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly; who errs and comes short again and again; because there is not effort without error and shortcomings; but who does actually strive to do the deed; who knows the great enthusiasm, the great devotion, who spends himself in a worthy cause, who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement and who at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly." In this video we show our new and improved process on how to etch the steel after heat treat to bring out that beautiful pattern. If too late.no problem that is how we learn. I was wondering about the thoughts of cold or rust blui Requests: Array This is commonly sold in home improvement stores and pool supply stores in gallon jugs. Now we're using muriatic acid and loving it. If you add additional HCl, the etching solution eventually (after many PCB's) becomes mostly cupric chloride, which is also an excellent etchant. Be extra careful at this stage not to touch it! Add the acid to the water to avoid harmful splashing of acid. Does muriatic acid etch metal? What Is Muriatic Acid? Cleaning Uses and Safety - The Spruce Ecommerce Site by NeONBRAND. After 10 minutes take it out and give it a quick dip in the bucket of water. This steel had been produced for 11 centuries, and in just about a generation, the means of its manufacture was entirely lost. How do I heat-treat 3V/CPM-154 Damascus billet? It will certainly freeze being significantly water. Such is what I measured from home; it's typically advertised as 30%-32%. Put the holes on both sides or you'll get a bar with raindrop on one side and random on the other. In your well-ventilated area, mix together one part muriatic acid to two parts hydrogen peroxide in a container thats big enough to fit the whole blade. To the iron add 100mL of water and 100mL of 12M hydrochloric acid. How to Etch With Hydrochloric Acid & Hydrogen Peroxide 3:1, 4:1, or 5:1 distilled water to the FeCl are all commonly used dilutions. Should I dilute ferric chloride for etching? Pimp Your Knife: Acid Etching - Knife Life - Blade HQ Ken Fong Tom, diluting muriatic doesn't make ferric chloride, no. Hydrochloric acid has a normal pH of 1.5 to 3.5, while muriatic acid has a pH of about 1 to 2. How to Etch Stainless and Carbon Damascus Steel - Balbachdamast South Buffing closes steel pores, which will keep the acid from getting it and will end with an unusual etch. I'm not going to cover how to make damascus steel, there's lots of information online and it's pretty simple. Add more acid if necessary. Be sure to always wear the appropriate protective gear when youre working with acid. my sword tanks tend to always be in flux, i end up adding peroxide distilled water, or fresh ferric to get then to etch nicely another question is my shop is in garage , it gets cold here will ferric acid freeze , dont want it bursting pvc pipe? Is there any difference with polish? Our mission is preserving and promoting the ancient craft of forged knives through education, testing and certification. Pour 1 part acid into 10 parts water to make an acid solution. Share Save Helvetica Comment CaiLei 3 years ago Follow It is an ultra high carbon steel that achieved liquid state which should, theoretically, allow you to get a homogeneous steel product with equal carbon distribution and no slag inclusions at all. Diluting Phosphoric or Muriatic acid for fuel tank cleaning The "active ingredient" in ferric chloride solution is hydrochloric acid. Or could one actually temper a knife in hot vinegar? Mixing is a hazardous process (add acid to the peroxide, not the other way around!) 2 Remove any burrs on the edges of the steel. As many Damascus wars come from the market, consumers and new consumers in this matter want to know: Damascus is a solid iron? 03-25-2007, 09:56 PM. How do I heat-treat my 1075 or 0-1 Carbon Damascus billet? Each Damascus Steel ring is uniqueno two designs will look exactly alike. Etching is done by exposing the cleaned and polished specimen surface to suitable etching solution such as those described in Table 1. Joshua C States. Bubbling air through it hastens the re-oxidation. Did you make this project? For example, you would use 1 cup of the acid to mix with 2 cups of the peroxide. thank will wait till summer then to try it. A Pocket Sundial From a Broken Pocket Watch! Muriatic Acid, Ferric Chloride, Radio Shack PCB Etchant (Computer board etching solution) and I have he. Concrete Etching - How to Acid Wash Concrete Surfaces Yourself You can also make it, by adding Fe to HCl. So, your foliate results arent a surprise. Works great. Like is itmore effective on a piece ground to 120, than one polished to 1000? (Recipe varies between smith). Very nice blade! Box 71092Springfield, OR 97475. I have noticed that Muriatic will produce a much shinier surface than Ferric, without a lot of the black that you would expect. Dissolve enough iron in ityes. Your email address will not be published. 3 years ago. Step 1: Sanding Bring your Damascus to a 400 to 600 grit finish. Ferric Chloride - 1 Quart - 1000 ML - Copper Etchant Solution - Stainless Steel Etching Cream 4.6 (203) $2499 $22.49 with Subscribe & Save discount FREE delivery Tue, Feb 28 on $25 of items shipped by Amazon Small Business MG Chemicals - 415-4L Ferric Chloride Copper Etchant Solution, 4L Liquid Bottle 4.7 (269) $4835 - $6862 FREE delivery on Step 8. Wash thoroughly your piece of liquor and view it with pure oils. 5. ), Copyright 2012 - 2020 American Bladesmith Society | All Rights Reserved, Bill Moran School of Bladesmithing at Texarkana College. How do you prepare ferric chloride solution for etching? Though there was a demand for Damascus steel, in the 19th century it stopped being made. It's used to etch printed circuit boards. Mix cup of baking soda with 1-2 quarts of water and spray the muriatic acid to neutralize it. Following. Acid is generally mixed at a ratio of 3 parts water to 1 part acid for sufficient strength to etch properly. Muriatic acid needs no dilution. Neutralize the acid and Lightly sand the oxides off with scotch bright or 2000/3000 grit sand paper and re etch (don't touch it with your fingers). Dilute by adding 1 part of Muriatic acid to 10 parts of water or 1 cup of acid per liter. Damascus Etching Is Completed With Ferric Chloride or Muriatic Acid Meet your sellers . https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdJMFMqnbLYqv965xd64vYg, https://www.etsy.com/shop/JStatesBladesmith. Bring your Damascus at the end of grit 400 to 600. Essentially you forge weld 2 contrasting types of steel (I used 15N20 and 75Ni8) then manipulate it to make a pattern. When someone feels their ferric chloride batch has "gone bad", you can add a tablespoon or so of muriatic acid and regenerate it.
